Lumy

FEEDBACKS ON THE RECENT WIND CHANGE

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Hi, I am glad that something was done about wind finally. But the recent nerf on vacuum was overtuned and I think everyone agrees.

Before nerfing a jutsu by that much, I think the whole kit should be looked at. Now that vacuum is nerfed to the ground, Wind with no weapons becomes not viable in 1v1s & in large scale fights.

I think one of the main problem was the fact that vacuum, the most damaging jutsu that scales x3 had a CC effect wich was utter broken. I think taking off the stun on vacuum would already be great, since this stun allowed people to combo even longer. But right now, THERE IS NO WAY THE THREE SPHERES LANDS unless you have a snare/stun.

Here is some ideas that could've been made :

CP increased to 45, taking off the stun, increased CD to 23, stays instant & selftsuns(1sec)(maybe even 2sec).  -> This would be the most fair nerf, since it already used to selftun for 1sec, that way the combo wouldn't be free and less spammable with that high of a chakra cost and that high of a CD.

- If we take in consideration the recent patch note, vacuum now has a cast time... the first sphere should stun... there is no way the three spheres land in a 1v1 fight after waiting 1sec to land it even on a situation where your opponent is snared.

- Keeping vacuum the way it was but nerfing the kit, jutsus like windclaw/drilling air bullets being able to hit three times are the thing that made wind overkill. Those nerfs would still make wind viable in 1v1.

A 1tile jutsu, that has traveling jutsus (projectiles) with a cast time is too much.

Now the main problem is that what we call ''Leaf's wind'' , wind with no access to tool became too weak wich is wrong in my opinion because it feels like the jutsu was balanced around the fact that people could easily land vacuum with CC weapons. The thing that annoyed most players is the fact that you could get bursted out with no use of skill by the help of weapons like fans(+ tornadoes) and pipes. For myself, it annoyed me that int wind users benefited more from Tornadoes than a Pure Str Wind.

At the end of the day, Wind wasn't buffed in the past for no reason. Now it's back to the point where it has no purpose, it's not good 1v1s nor in group fights now. Again , I am speaking about wind with no tool.

The thing people does not understand is that the only reason why vacuum SEEMED to be easy to land is the fact that tools like fan and pipe allowed wind users to land this jutsu so easily it was cancer ( a jutsu like scalpel too). Vacuum is a one tile traveling jutsu that you can't even see travel with your eyes, if you take off the stun on it and keep the selfstun it will end up being punishable. Fixing the fact that people can use fan and pipes by nerfing the early weapons, making tornadoes share CD with Vacuum there wouldn't be ''easy'' ways to land vacuum with no punishment (if the stun is taken away, it will be punishable). Only luck can help you land a projectile with one tile that travels too fast for the eye with a cast time. Int Wind deserved that nerf, but I think it was wrongfully nerfed and that jutsus like claw and drilling deserved a heavy change more than anything.

I do not expect any of these suggestions to be added but the nerf was definitely overtuned and I just want it to be looked at. Would be appreciated. Cheers. 

 

 

 

 

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i dont care it was nerf i think we all knew it needed a nerf but it def was overtuned all that really needed to be done was lower the base dmg of vacuum with removed stun and its fine lol. this nerf makes vacuum only useable with water, light or pipe 

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As a wind user wind Forsure needed a nerf, but the way it is rn is just unplayable for me, Could of just taken down some damage or remove the stun from vacuum abit,It's so dissapointing because i can't find a wind+earth Combo unless it's just a earth combo by it self with wind shuriken (it literally feels like im playing a solo mastery). @Ueda Please look at the suggestions Lumy provided!

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5 minutes ago, Lumy said:

CP increased to 45, taking off the stun, increased CD to 23, stays instant.  -> This would be the most fair nerf, since it already used to selftun for 1sec, that way the combo wouldn't be free and less spammable with that high of a chakra cost and that high of a CD.

Yes.

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45 minutes ago, Lumy said:

Hi, I am glad that something was done about wind finally. But the recent nerf on vacuum was overtuned and I think everyone agrees.

Before nerfing a jutsu by that much, I think the whole kit should be looked at. Now that vacuum is nerfed to the ground, Wind with no weapons becomes not viable in 1v1s & in large scale fights.

I think one of the main problem was the fact that vacuum, the most damaging jutsu that scales x3 had a CC effect wich was utter broken. I think taking off the stun on vacuum would already be great, since this stun allowed people to combo even longer. But right now, THERE IS NO WAY THE THREE SPHERES LANDS unless you

Here is some ideas that could've been made :

CP increased to 45, taking off the stun, increased CD to 23, stays instant & selftsuns(1sec)(maybe even 2sec).  -> This would be the most fair nerf, since it already used to selftun for 1sec, that way the combo wouldn't be free and less spammable with that high of a chakra cost and that high of a CD.

- If we take in consideration the recent patch note, vacuum now has a cast time... the first sphere should stun... there is no way the three spheres land in a 1v1 fight after waiting 1sec to land it even on a situation where your opponent is snared.

- Keeping vacuum the way it was but nerfing the kit, jutsus like windclaw/drilling air bullets being able to hit three times are the thing that made wind overkill. Those nerfs would still make wind viable in 1v1.

 

Now the main problem is that what we call ''Leaf's wind'' , wind with no access to tool became too weak wich is wrong in my opinion because it feels like the jutsu was balanced around the fact that people could easily land vacuum with CC weapons. The thing that annoyed most players is the fact that you could get bursted out with no use of skill by the help of weapons like fans(+ tornadoes) and pipes. For myself, it annoyed me that int wind users benefited more from Tornadoes than a Pure Str Wind.

At the end of the day, Wind wasn't buffed in the past for no reason. Now it's back to the point where it has no purpose, it's not good 1v1s nor in group fights now. Again , I am speaking about wind with no tool.

I do not expect any of these suggestions to be added but the nerf was definitely overtuned and I just want it to be looked at. Would be appreciated. Cheers. 

 

 

 

 

as long as wind users cant one shoot others i dont care how they nerf it ;-; .

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Tornadoes sharing CD with vacuum wouldve been the best thing. That way no path is affected because of the abuse of the other

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6 minutes ago, Lumy said:

Tornadoes sharing CD with vacuum wouldve been the best thing. That way no path is affected because of the abuse of the other

that still make pipe op :(

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A deserved nerf. The only thing that I would change about it is shift the stun from last sphere to the first one. Since the jutsu will mostly land from range now it would ensure that if the first sphere lands the others will follow up.

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21 minutes ago, Halfblood said:

No.Wind finally is fine.

i dont like you but i agree.

13 minutes ago, Yamikami said:

A deserved nerf. The only thing that I would change about it is shift the stun from last sphere to the first one. Since the jutsu will mostly land from range now it would ensure that if the first sphere lands the others will follow up.

i agree.

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I don't understand why this community complains so much about a nerf after complaining so hard that it needs a nerf. You guys brought this upon yourselves you know? If nobody complains to Rory about a mastery nothing is going to happen. 

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I couldn't agree more - spot on analysis and comments! - I've played around with the new vacuum for a few hours, and wow its impossible to hit in 1v1 without a snare / tool. Luckily I could mix up my new combo, but its bot near amazing as compared to the old combo- anyway! @Lumy Great post! 

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1 minute ago, Luhan said:

I couldn't agree more - spot on analysis and comments! - I've played around with the new vacuum for a few hours, and wow its impossible to hit in 1v1 without a snare / tool. Luckily I could mix up my new combo, but its bot near amazing as compared to the old combo- anyway! @Lumy Great post! 

I've hit it 4 times. Learn how to aim. 

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Just now, Dad said:

I've hit it 4 times. Learn how to aim. 

Do u have or use a "tool" aka a fan? - Yes so please read what I just commented and what Lumy said ^

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I think by the time, the community will realise how wind is not viable without a tool with this recent change. Saying you can aim a jutsu like vacuum that you can barely see with the eyes and that travels as a projectile unlike spear is absurd.

Tool abused should be looked into

Claw and Vacuum needed a rework, but by the time, I know things will change.

But the nerf is trully overtuned, regardless.

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3 hours ago, Luhan said:

Do u have or use a "tool" aka a fan? - Yes so please read what I just commented and what Lumy said ^

Yes, I use a fan. Lumy's post is TL;DR but I understand the concept because the discussion was already held in Nin Discord so everything Lumy posted I pretty much agree with. However, I who have been playing for three years already understand the concept of how to aim and use a one second cast technique. I have already landed the move without using a fan. In order to survive in this world you must adapt to the balance changes. Think of it similar to great fire bullet, or wind cyclone (fan move). I understand both arguments; but until it is changed; instead of complaining, start practicing. 

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Wind got obviously nerfed the wrong way as usual, but the meta is better this way.

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I agree that wind needed a nerf, but imo this is the wrong nerf.

 

1. I started playing wind 2.5 years ago, and it just feels like a completely different mastery today.

Wiki says: Wind Elemental Mastery allows the ninja to learn Wind techniques that are sharp, fast and deadly.

But over the last 2 years, 3/6 of the wind jutsus got cast time (wind bullets, wind scythe and now vacuum)  (4/6 of the jutsus got cast time now in total)

in the past it felt like a sniper mastery, when someone was standing in the wrong place even if it was extremely far from you, you could snipe him with instacast bullets or vacuum, and scythe was the instacast equivalent to water/fire bullets.

Now wind feels kinda slow..

 

2. I heard people say that one of the highest dmg jutsu shouldnt be used so easily with cc, which is true but for example:

Fire dragon got 3 tiles wide hitbox, easier to land after flicker, it pierces so multiple enemies can be hit, got same dmg as vacuum and its instacast.

In the end, I still believe the issue was tornados not vacuum, putting them on the same cd will solve the high-burst-stun combo and still make them both relevant.

 

3. Wind bullets(lvl 20 jutsu) is now a better version of vacuum (lvl30 jutsu).

both got 1sec cast time, each air bullet got better dmg each sphere bullet.

air bullets got 3 tiles wide, sphere is 1.

if the enemy is stunned/snared, its still better to use air bullets use the direction bug/feature for triple hit.

 

On a different note:

So many cast time and self-stuns jutsus makes the game slower imo, maybe instead of nerfing a jutsu with cast time/self stun, we could make a different mechanism such as self-bleeding (double-edge sword), or even stronger self-bleeding if you miss the jutsu, or maybe ability/item to deflect back to user certain damage of his own jutsu (like when sasuke deflected danzo's wind shurikens with his sword or neji deflected naruto shurikens with rotation)

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