Persona Kurama

Gentle Fist/Taijutsu

29 posts in this topic

Where do I begin?

Pressure Point: It costs 96 chakra points. That takes away your ability to use your jutsus and forces you to stand still to get it slowly back. The basic attack goes away on feints too and you got to wait out a timer that can be almost as long as BI. My FAN is more useful than this jutsu even with the hastle of switching it on and off. I strongly SUGGEST pressure point gets a reduction in chakra cost and even chakra drain on hit.

Palm Bottom/MC: This is legit all Gentle fist has become. Flicker -> MC -> palm. Is this bad? Well any instant connect combo is bad, but it's the ONLY thing that a Gentle Fist user can land. Without it you are dead.

Rotation: It got nerfed when the silenced was added. Now the patch gave it run cast. So now it's predictable, still costs a lot of chakra, and ya pretty much get punished from self stun.  The silence was enough imo as it stopped Flicker -> Mc -> palm -> rotation. (48cp) 

16 Palms: Useful when it lands. Too bad it never lands. Slow, predictable (32cp)

Hybrids: Flicker -> mc -> dash -> palm -> kick (can throw tools in these combos too if you got good ping). 

*Agility > Gentle Fist*

Agility: Has the same combos as gentle fist plus utility. I.e. extra sub and buff on speed. Basic dmg from agi is always more favorable though for hybrids it can stack with PP, but people only use that method if you can use it before a 1v1. Agilities Morning Peacock and Whirling Kick is way more easier to land than rotation and 16 palms. Also the animation/hitbox is questionable for morning peacock. Peacock hits me from the sides of the individual but no other jutsu can.

 What am I asking?

I'm asking to make Gentle Fist more playable as just using MC/Palm alone is not fun. PP/Rotation/16 palms - all not worth using as they don't land and hurt YOU instead of the enemy.

I'm asking for a crackdown on hybrids -- No, more specifically chain combos.

Recent Gameplay

I noticed stun rolls and homings always rule in this game. I know I can't change it and should embrace it, but it's not as fun. People think I played Persona for meta, but I never did as I just enjoyed the fluent run and hit without self stuns that Gentle Fist used to have provided me with, but that's gone now. It was refreshing from my Wolfskin character that was glued to the ground with self stuns (Fire/Wind Leaf side). Also, I could have gone much worst with Pers and made him Str/agi/med, but idc like I said idc for meta and I want to embrace that twin lion fist hyuga vibe. 

P.S. Fire is hurting too right now. Phoenix is good and wall is meh (tho wall can hurt you with sub -> hits). People outran my dragon when they started running from the square right in front of me. GG.

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Just do as I did, scrap the account and play different mastery. :D 

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I forgot to mention vacuum so...

Vacuum: The run cast makes sense with others nerfs, but the less range doesn't make sense. It's already been out runable. But, I can still use this more in a fight than rotation, PP, and 16 so I dunno anymore \o/

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With flicker gf and tai are still strong even with the recent changes. I think those changes would be great if a change to flicker is added first.

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I understand him tho. Im playing gf since the start of open beta, then after stat req ive been playing pure gf ever since. I also like the mastery cause i like Hyuugas, its like all these ppl that went fire/light for Sasuke etc etc. And all ive heard from ppl was like "just play something else" lol.

Pure gf had already a pretty straight forward gameplay, as a tai you could/can at least differ ur strategies due to utilities. 

We have to also remember that GF is supposed to be played as a single mastery cause it has only 1 choice later on - advancement. But rn its silly what happened. 

Pressure Point - as stated up there, issa joke. Its easier to just switch shit with fan, u do more dmg and u disturb at least, without robbing urself from half of the chakra. 
Rotation - before it was an emergency move as ur enemies recovered sooner from it, than the caster. Now it costs around 40-50 i believe, while Kunai does better dmg lol. 
16 palms - as always lmao.As stated above.
Palm Bottom - 1 tile range.... without the usage of flicker (it doesnt always land with that obviously). I found 16 palms easier to land, than this one against decent opponent (without flicker ofc). I think its the only 1 tile range jutsu in game :thinking: NORMAL ATTACK IS EASIER to land, since normal attack goes all around the user.
Vacuum : Ah yes dear vacums....became 5 tiles range, still slow af, and 1s cast time. To counter vacuums you just need to WALK THE OTHER WAY when u see a gf user casting animation. Literally your eyes counter it. 

I have also pure tai and earth/wind char. They are more fun to play by a shitton at this point. Instead of reworking tai and gf standalone, i feel like it was nerfed to weaken hybrids (tai+gf) which are still better lmao. I knew this would happen. smh. 

// EDIT 
Forgot to mention that this game had 4 active pure gfs, rest of the cream were hybrids. Now "balancing" made those 4 to either go hybrid or switch characters or go inactive, whatevs.

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All you ever did was flicker into roll over combo though. :thinking:

Nerf flicker, make GF/Tai separate.

Then think of buffs.

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14 minutes ago, Tatara said:

All you ever did was flicker into roll over combo though. :thinking:

giphy.gif

Always has to be someone who wants to ruin a legitimate topic which is funny coming from someone who I killed casually on Wolfskin. 

I played both ways with flicker and without. Ik damn well you use it too, I've seen. It's available for every mastery and never said it shouldn't get tweaked. Go home kiddie.

P.S. Nice edit.

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1 minute ago, Persona Kurama said:

giphy.gif

Always has to be someone who wants to ruin a legitimate topic which is funny coming from someone who I killed casually on Wolfskin. 

I played both ways with flicker and without. Ik damn well you use it too, I've seen. It's available for every mastery and never said it shouldn't get tweaked. Go home kiddie.

Note to that, I started to use it very late into the game about three weeks ago and all I could've done with it is land a basic attack, a lucky senbon sometimes unlike some comboes like Earth, which got nerfed or GF/Tai that still see light. You flicker and there is no counter-play to whats coming next, I have witnessed this far too many times. Which is why I want to see this nerfed and GF/Tai separated. Only then true balance can begin.

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10 minutes ago, Tatara said:

Note to that, I started to use it very late into the game about three weeks ago and all I could've done with it is land a basic attack, a lucky senbon sometimes unlike some comboes like Earth, which got nerfed or GF/Tai that still see light. You flicker and there is no counter-play to whats coming next, I have witnessed this far too many times. Which is why I want to see this nerfed and GF/Tai separated. Only then true balance can begin.

Tatara: 'It's okay if I do it because I did it later than you' blah blah whatever bro. Flicker just makes the jutsu into a homing just like wind's hurricane blade, or earth's homing or str wm's. SO if you want to get rid of flicker get rid of the rest too and stop being one sided. The real problem in the flicker -> tai spam is the roll because like I said before getting hit by one jutsu automatically is the same as other masteries, but the getting stuck in your enemies endless loop of knockbacks is different.

Plus like Crow said, the jutsus are near impossible to land without flicker.

Also noticed tai moves canceling other tai's instant casts. How does that make sense. <-- That was unrelated just throwing it out there.

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Just now, Persona Kurama said:

Tatara: 'It's okay if I do it because I did it later than you' blah blah whatever bro. Flicker just makes the jutsu into a homing just like wind's hurricane blade, or earth's homing or str wm's. SO if you want to get rid of flicker get rid of the rest too and stop being one sided. The real problem in the flicker -> tai spam is the roll because like I said before getting hit by one jutsu automatically is the same as other masteries, but the stuck in your enemies loop is different.

That is what I have been saying for a while now, no need to repeat after me.

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I dont care about flicker, tweak it, delete it for what i care. 
Pure Gf has to be tweaked and tai/gf hybrid should go gerara and be separated. End of story. Lets focus on gf shall we?

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2 minutes ago, Crowlock said:

I dont care about flicker, tweak it, delete it for what i care. 
Pure Gf has to be tweaked and tai/gf hybrid should go gerara and be separated. End of story. Lets focus on gf shall we?

That is what I am saying, the hybrid needs to go. Only then you can start balancing GF again.

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1 hour ago, Persona Kurama said:

Tatara: 'It's okay if I do it because I did it later than you' blah blah whatever bro. Flicker just makes the jutsu into a homing just like wind's hurricane blade, or earth's homing or str wm's. SO if you want to get rid of flicker get rid of the rest too and stop being one sided. The real problem in the flicker -> tai spam is the roll because like I said before getting hit by one jutsu automatically is the same as other masteries, but the getting stuck in your enemies endless loop of knockbacks is different.

Plus like Crow said, the jutsus are near impossible to land without flicker.

Also noticed tai moves canceling other tai's instant casts. How does that make sense. <-- That was unrelated just throwing it out there.

The problem is that GF does not exist in a vacuum separate from flicker, when you're discussing balance you have to take into account how the jutsu will interact with other jutsu, including body flicker. Finding any kind of proper balance for Tai and GF is almost impossible because of how flicker works. Jutsu are either weak as hell to the point it doesn't matter if you flicker with them, or they're too powerful because flicker makes them unavoidable. @Ueda needs to realize that even after all these nerfs flicker is still a problem.

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11 minutes ago, Mikecw said:

The problem is that GF does not exist in a vacuum separate from flicker, when you're discussing balance you have to take into account how the jutsu will interact with other jutsu, including body flicker. Finding any kind of proper balance for Tai and GF is almost impossible because of how flicker works. Jutsu are either weak as hell to the point it doesn't matter if you flicker with them, or they're too powerful because flicker makes them unavoidable. @Ueda needs to realize that even after all these nerfs flicker is still a problem.

Tai God has spoken.

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You can’t really compare homing wich is one jutsu to a flicker combo lol. Flicker needs the nerf first obviously.

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Gentle Fist definitely needs changes. Note I said "changes", not buffs or nerfs to its damage.

It's way too one-directional. You either have flicker/sub or you don't. There's no other though.

  • If you don't have them up, good luck landing pretty much any of your jutsus, because they're melee range and now-more-than-before, they've become predictable due to the cast time added on bullet. You just have to run and wait for its cd, and then get flamed by Ele Users saying "nub just waits for flicker and runs during cd".
  • If you DO have flicker/sub up, then the enemy can say goodbye to 1/3 of their hp, while their body gets molested from your rapid knock-backs and damage, and they'll complain that there's no counter-play to the combo (because there really isn't, you can't do much if a GF macros 5 jutsus in their combo).

Either way, you'll get element users hating you.
And buffing/nerfing damage won't do any good. 
A single buff would make it too strong, and a single nerf will make it trash.

Some jutsus just need a complete makeover, cause right now GF's jutsus encourage one-directionality.

 

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3 hours ago, Lumy said:

You can’t really compare homing wich is one jutsu to a flicker combo lol. Flicker needs the nerf first obviously.

Flicker initiates the first strike. What comes after is completely separate. If you take flicker out of the equation and I hit you with palm I can still run and do MC  -> agi moves. So yes, flicker is comparable to a homing as it gives you a free hit as long as you're in range. It's the same deal except ya can sometimes run diagonal to get out of a flicker + attack. Chain attacks are separate from flicker, but flicker + attack is a homing. You wouldn't be mad if someone hit you once with flicker because all you do Lumy is spam your earth homing which is the same thing. It's the chain that pisses you off. 

Personally, I just want Gentle Fist to be more viable than this one chain string 24/7. I want to be able to use a mixture of all the GF jutsus. 

Again, if flicker is to be changed it's whatever, but I just don't want flicker vanishing alone to be thought of as the answer to fixing Gentle Fist/Taijutsu.

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Flicker combo is way different than an homing. Especially when it allows you to chain jutsus. It needs a tweak before thoses changes, your ideas would work if flicker wasn't in the equation. They're actually great.

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2 minutes ago, Lumy said:

Flicker combo is way different than an homing. Especially when it allows you to chain jutsus. It needs a tweak before thoses changes, your ideas would work if flicker wasn't in the equation.

The chain is there without flicker. Flicker just makes landing it astronomically easier. There should be no chains/rolls in this game in any mastery imo because the jutsus might as well be the same then.  And like Hao said it makes it one directional as the same type of fighting is there over and over. There's no creative mixture between the jutsus available. 

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6 minutes ago, Persona Kurama said:

The chain is there without flicker. Flicker just makes landing it astronomically easier. There should be no chains/rolls in this game in any mastery imo because the jutsus might as well be the same then.  

The chain is avoidable without flicker especially. So yeah, flicker is an issue. Shouldn't be that easier to land jutsus after using flicker.

11 minutes ago, Persona Kurama said:

 You wouldn't be mad if someone hit you once with flicker because all you do Lumy is spam your earth homing which is the same thing. It's the chain that pisses you off. 

Also, stop being defensive when I'm just not agreeing with you. Being chained by flicker and having no way to counter that is pretty much annoying, and unfair. It's my statement that's all.

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